Support Forum
No offence intended, Mr. Papa. I come at it from the basic user's perspective -- if a tool adds functionality that can't be utilized fully without relying on time-shifted support, that's an incomplete tool.
Functionality is awesome, and I appreciate the inherent flexibility of Simple:Press and its add-ons. (Or I wouldn't have paid for it!) But functionality without instruction is like a knowing there's a banquet behind that locked door, but there's no key. 🙂
Brandon C's added documentation is a huge help. I look forward to it (and other aspects of the codex) being fully fleshed out.
Many thanks!
Matthew Wayne Selznick ~ http://www.mattselznick.com ~ http://indieauthormarketing.info
Matthew Selznick said
I'd still like to see the Identities plugin integrate with Simple:Press in all the other places one would expect. I guess I'm a little baffled that the plugin was released into the wild (seemingly) half-done.I'm committed to using Simple:Press (just paid for a year of support) over bbPress or BuddyPress, but I confess I'm a little disappointed that plugins don't work "out of the box" without code-level manipulation.
Yes, this. A plug-in should be plug-and-play, not plug-and-learn-php. I'm frustrated.
The identities plugin is one that does require you add something to your theme to display it. There is just no way to create it so that it's plug(in) and play. It is designed on purpose to allow you to create any identity and put it anywhere in your forum. If it was plug and play you would be stuck with wherever someone else thought it should go and what it should say.
The codex info on how to use it explains how to use it but there could be more info in the forum > Plugin page that explains where to get the info and why. I'll bring that up in the ticketing system for review.
I really dont understand what plug in play means here... where do you want your custom identity to show up? I can assume you mean with the other type identities, but do you want it first in the list? last in the list? somewhere in the middle? or on a new line above the current ones? or perhaps below? each user has their own unique requirements of where they want to locate something...
Where possible, we will always go for power and flexibility for the users - not rigidness and limits... I would much, much rather spend time in the support forum helping folks to use a template tag and get it exactly the way they want than tell them they cannot do something because we didnt make the system flexible enough...
if you look at an sp theme, or wp theme for that matter, you will see they are typically just a series of template tags with some php for control... seems to me like a natural progression than any new display elements would also be displayed with a template tag like the current template tags... allows maximum flexibility and customization for users...
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I think the frustration might stem from the way (most) plugins work in the rest of the WordPress world: they add functionality that is accessed via a widget in an aside / sidebar, via a shortcode, or, if the user chooses, via a template tag directly in the theme.
Since the UI of SP lives entirely in a single WP "page," plugins mostly can't be exploited in widgets, because widgets live in sidebars and you just can't have a sidebar in a page in WP. Similarly, you can't use shortcode because shortcodes live in the content of a page, and SP creates all of its content dynamically within the page.
SP is inherently flexible, and that's a very good thing. Unfortunately, it's not practical for most end-users to take advantage of that flexibility unless they also have experience as WP theme developers. To be most successful, I'm guessing SP wants to be attractive to the average end-user while still having great bells and whistles for the theme developer.
Mr Papa mentioned that he'd rather spend time in the support forum helping folks than build a less flexible SP. That's commendable, but here's a suggestion that would be more efficient for all involved:
Complete the SP documentation, and make sure it's presented in a linear way and written to be as understandable as possible for the average end user (not the average WP theme developer.) Also, don't release a plugin until its documentation is complete and written to the same standard as the SP core docs.
Since access to support is a big part of the SP business model, put all the documentation (except for installation and upgrade) behind the paywall.
The advantage to users is obvious. The advantage to the SP staff is considerable, too: complete, clear documentation means staff spends less time answering questions in the forums -- time that can be spent working on the product itself, which I'm sure is a big priority.
Matthew Wayne Selznick ~ http://www.mattselznick.com ~ http://indieauthormarketing.info
very fair point on the documentation on the Coex... and we are working to complete it - its actually a bigger job than writing the plugin itself! most of the plugin and theme info is now complete... as are most sections outside of the api (which is members only) - which we have started digging into this month- BrandonC is doing yeoman work there!
I dont understand your comment about not having a sidebar in a page in wp... that is most definitely supported in wp - just look at our sidebar on any forum page... can you elaborate?
not sure I understand the comment about shortcodes either... Just about any plugin you use in wp that has shortcodes can be used within the forum (ie in posts)... SP also has many shortcodes for doing the same thing as our template functions... no, most of our API template functions dont have shortcodes, but some of the plugins have shortcodes equivalents... take a look at the template tags functions plugin... all its template functions have shortcode equivalents...
Granted, I may be different but 99% of the plugins I use, I manually place template tags - otherwise they dont show up in correct spot for me... of course, referring to ones that have visual display elements on the front end...
Matthew, thanks for your thoughts! Keep them coming! Interacting with our users is how we can continue to improve Simple:Press...
Visit Cruise Talk Central and Mr Papa's World
Mr Papa said
very fair point on the documentation on the Coex... and we are working to complete it - its actually a bigger job than writing the plugin itself!
I imagine so... I know it's often standard practice to write the documentation before the software is written, so that function follows intention. Can't speak to whether it's faster / easier..!
Mr Papa said
I dont understand your comment about not having a sidebar in a page in wp... that is most definitely supported in wp - just look at our sidebar on any forum page... can you elaborate?
To be specific, the content area of a page / post is seperate from the aside / sidebar area of a page / post. As far as I know, asides can't exist within the content area, at least not without some augmentation.
Mr Papa said
not sure I understand the comment about shortcodes either... Just about any plugin you use in wp that has shortcodes can be used within the forum (ie in posts)...
In posts within the SP "application" that lives in a WP page, I guess you mean. However, near as I can see, there's no way to put a shortcode in, say, the footer area of SP. For that, you have to use template tags (by design, I understand. Just using that as an example to better explain.)
Mr Papa said
Granted, I may be different but 99% of the plugins I use, I manually place template tags - otherwise they dont show up in correct spot for me... of course, referring to ones that have visual display elements on the front end...
You (and I, really) are different from the base user of WordPress, I'd guess. I'm not very proficient with php, but I'm not afraid to get my hands dirty and I've built themes from scratch. The base user, though, wants the same "install, activate and use" simplicity they get from most plugins in the WP repository, I'd argue. To clarify: I don't expect SP to follow suite, entirely. SP is built differently. That's why I strongly recommend making the documentation ready-for-prime-time, so expectations are entirely clear to the end user.
Mr Papa said
Matthew, thanks for your thoughts! Keep them coming! Interacting with our users is how we can continue to improve Simple:Press...
Careful what you wish for! I paid my money... I want to get the most for it.
Matthew Wayne Selznick ~ http://www.mattselznick.com ~ http://indieauthormarketing.info
Hello,
sp_PostIndexIdentityDisplay('','Amazon Author Page','Amazon Author Page');
this code works in spTopicView file and displays the user's identities in the post's page.
However, trying to insert that code into spProfileShow file, and nothing show up on the user's profile page.
assuming you are running SP version 5, you definitely have that file or you wouldn't get any lists of posts (topic view)... well, not entirely true - if you completely wrote your own custom theme, you might have called the template file something else - but that is our standard name...
by default it would be here: wp-content/sp-resources/forum-themes/default/templates/spTopicView.php
remember, its part of the SP theme so it would not be in the plugin core... and that assumes the default SP theme... if you are using a different theme, just replace default with your theme name...
and I say 'by default' because you can locate the forum themes where ever you want... the location is determined by forum - integration - storage locations...
if you look that template file (spTopicView.php) you will see where the other identities are displayed... just add it in there...
if you want to put it in the profile too, you will want to add to template files spProfileShow.php and spProfilePopupShow.php... either both or just the one you want...
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Thank you, Mr Papa.
I was a bit confused about the structure of this plugin...and indeed was looking in the plugin core.
Now I found the spTopicView, spProfileShow, spProfilePopupShow....copied the same line everywhere....the user's identities appear only in the topic, not on his profile...
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